The Conclusions of the VIII meeting of the EUROSAI Training Committee, Pultusk (Poland), 24 June 2003

The EUROSAI training committee (ETC), consisting, according to the decision made in Madrid on 16 February 2000 by the governing board, of 8 members, namely Spain and France for the presidency, Portugal, United Kingdom, Czech Republic, Germany, Poland and Denmark, held a meeting in Pultusk (Poland) on 24 June 2003. According to the decision made by the Governing board in Copenhagen on 7 March 2002, SAI of Lithuania attended this meeting as an observer. Due to the agenda, representatives of IDI, SIGMA-OECD, the European Court of Auditors, SAIs of Hungary and of the EUROSAI presidency (SAI of the Russian Federation) were also invited to attend this meeting.

Mr Jacek Jezierski, Vice President of the Polish Supreme Chamber of Control, welcomed the participants on behalf of Mr Miroslav Sekula, president of the Polish Supreme Chamber of Control.

1. Adoption of the conclusions of the Lisbon ETC meeting and adoption of the draft agenda:

The draft conclusions of the Lisbon ETC meeting were adopted. The draft agenda of the Pultusk meeting was adopted.

2. Training Strategy : finalisation of the questionnaire and next steps:

Mr Perron, representative of the SAI of France, reminded participants of the previous steps (preliminary discussion in July 2002 in Madrid, consultation of ETC members at the end of 2002, “brainstorming” meeting in January in Lisbon, working in sub-groups till April, circulation of three successive versions of the draft questionnaire between May and June, taking into account remarks and suggestions).

Each point and wording of the last draft version of the questionnaire was discussed and, when necessary, amended, after reaching a consensus among participants.

a The SAI of France will send the last agreed version of the questionnaire to EUROSAI General Secretariat for the end of June 2003.

a EUROSAI General Secretariat will send the questionnaire to all members, with a deadline on 25 July 2003.

a Answers will be gathered and analysed by the SAI of France during August 2003.

a Results of this analysis will be sent to ETC members for comments in September.

a On that basis, a report presenting the answers to the questionnaire will be prepared by the SAI of France for the Governing Board to be held on 28 October 2003 in Rome.

3. Training activities:

3.1. EUROSAI – IDI co-operation : situation and prospects:

Mrs Geagea made a presentation on the current stage and next steps of the EUROSAI Long Term Regional Training Programme (LTRTP).

-       Concerning the Phase I, aimed at SAI’s of the candidate countries, the cycle was completed with the second and final Regional Audit Workshop held in Nicosia (Cyprus), from 3 to 14 February 2003. Training materials is available on CD-Rom for target SAIs.

-       Concerning the Phase II, aimed at SAI’s from the Balkan and eastern “non-candidate” countries, after the Strategic Planning Workshop held in Zagreb (Croatia) in November 2002, training activities will take place from Spring 2004 to Fall 2005, after preparation in 2003 (translation of course materials, selection of participants, recruitment of a Russian speaking assistant, etc.). The first training activity (Course Design and Development Workshop) could be held in Bulgaria (to be confirmed). Funding of the phase II is not yet secured, but the Norwegian Government still express a keen interest, and a contribution is requested from EUROSAI budget, in accordance with budgetary decisions made during the 2002 Congress in Moscow. Except from the latter, no other funding sources were identified.

In addition to this presentation, Mrs Geagea confirmed IDI willingness to work more closely with INTOSAI working groups and committees, and to deliver Training activities derived from this collaboration into the different INTOSAI regions. For instance, co-operation with the INTOSAI public debt committee provided a basis for a five week training partnership in the OLACEFS region, benefiting to 24 auditors. Training materials from this workshop will be translated in English and then available for EUROSAI members. The same kind of co-operation is under way with the INTOSAI environmental working group.

3.2. Training events : Results of the Seminar on Evaluation of internal control in Prague (26-28 May 2003):

Mr Michovsky, representative of the SAI of the Czech Republic, provided information on the Seminar on Evaluation of internal control held in Prague (26-28 May 2003). This topic, very high on candidate countries agenda, is, as well, of upmost importance in European union and a key element of current developments in the audit profession standards. As a consequence, the Seminar attracted more than 80 participants from 33 countries, as well as representatives from the EU Commission, the ECA and SIGMA. The seminar, moderated by experts from SIGMA and the ECA, was divided in five main blocks, including presentation of case studies and discussion panels.
Mr Michovsky reminded participants of the main conclusions of the seminar. All materials and presentations will be available on CD-rom, and on line, on the Czech Republic SAO web site (with a link from EUROSAI web site).

During the discussion, participants congratulated the SAI of the Czech Republic for the perfect organisation and high interest of contributions and discussion. However, even if these issues were smoothly dealt with, the attendance rate (> 80) observed for this seminar increases necessarily the logistics and cost burden for the host SAI, with the risk to change these professional events into more solemn conferences. Ways and means to maintain the “workshop spirit” of the Training events should be explored (limiting attendance? organising sub-regional workshops?…).

a In the context of the Training Strategy, lessons drawn from Training events already organised should be taken into account in defining the format and features of the next events.

a A certificate of attendance, co-signed by the hosting SAI and EUROSAI General Secretariat, will be sent to each participant in the Seminar.

4. Web resources:

Mr Sorensen, representative of the SAI of Denmark, made a presentation of the draft layout of the EUROSAI website, prepared by the SAI of Denmark in consultation with the SAI’s of France and Spain.

During the discussion, participants underlined the following points:

-       keeping the web site up-to-date and lively requires human resources to activate and maintain information, react to questions, especially if the ambition of the web site is growing. EUROSAI General Secretariat would need some support to face this new stage of the web site.

-       Due consideration to actual needs and real interest areas should be kept in mind while creating a new layout, trying to answer only to the questions raised by practice.

-       The part of the web site devoted to relations with Universities should be clarified, and maybe limited to those with which a true co-operation is ongoing in the audit field; the language issue is also important, many Universities web sites offering information only in their native language;

-       Final drafting of the design of the web pages has to be done, with the help of EUROSAI Presidency and General Secretariat. The convenience of including “welcome” pages on it was stressed.

a An amended version of the layout will be available for comments and suggestions in September 2003.

a The SAI of Denmark will present the layout to the next EUROSAI Governing Board meeting in Rome, in October 2003.

5. Information points:

5.1. The CIFPA programme in the UK:

Mr Bedwell, representative of the SAI of United Kingdom, made a presentation of the UK Chartered Institute of Public Finance and Accountancy’s (CIPFA) scope and role, including information about training programmes which could be set up and proposed in Europe for public sector qualifications in accountancy and audit. As regards the audit qualification, this would be a post-graduate qualification - “Diploma in Public Sector Auditing”, based on modular syllabus covering the subjects of auditing principles, planning, risk and internal control, systems based approach to audit, audit management and specialised audit roles, management accounting for auditors and financial accounting for auditors. Training courses would be taught in-country; delivered by local staff/institutions, supported by CIPFA training staff as appropriate.

During the discussion, the questions of cost and working languages rose. Detailed information on the cost of the programmes may be provided by CIFPA. Regarding languages, all courses are designed to be conducted not in English, but with local languages, and on the basis of syllabus derived from local law.

5.2. Information on EUROSAI Working Group on environmental auditing:

Jacek Jezierski, representative of the SAI of Poland, made a presentation of the current and forthcoming activities of the EUROSAI Working Group on environmental auditing. Now consisting of 23 members, the Working Group is very active, both for initiating co-operative audits among its members (for instance in the field of water protection, with many parallel audits performed on MARPOL, OSPAR, Danube River and Helsinki conventions), as well as for exchanging experiences during plenary meetings or specific seminars. In 2003, in addition to the organisation in Warsaw of the VIII meeting of the INTOSAI Working Group on environmental auditing, many audit activities are scheduled (audit of the Black Sea convention, audit of the Basel convention, a joint unique report on MARPOL convention developed by the Dutch SAI with contributions from each participating SAIs). On the Training side, the Dutch colleagues will welcome in December 2003 a WG Seminar on waste management auditing.

5.3. Results of the EUROSAI-EURORAI conference on Health Care:

Mr Pedersen, representative of the SAI of Denmark, gave some information on the second EUROSAI-EURORAI conference held in Copenhagen on the theme of health care on 5-7 June 2003. 136 participants from 28 SAIs and 25 RAIs attended the conference. Introduced by a summing up of the Madeira conference results, a synthesis of the EURORAI seminar held in Rouen, and an overview of the European landscape in the Health Sector made by a Danish lecturer, the conference offered many case studies on varied issues like experiences of co-operation, innovative audit techniques and approaches in this area, and adopted conclusions underlining the willingness to encourage further co-operation. All materials and contributions are available on the Danish SAI web site (www.rigsrevisionen.dk/eurosai-eurorai).

The results of the conference as well as the prospects for co-operation between SAIs and RAIs will be discussed during the next Governing Board meeting in Rome, 28 October 2003.

5.4. Activities in the acceding countries network:

Mrs Hahn representative of the ECA, made a presentation on the activities of the working group on audit manuals set up by the presidents of candidate countries SAIs, in liaison with ECA and SIGMA. 3 workshops are scheduled in 2003, the first one, on “auditing of IT systems” already held in Tirana from 11 to 13 June 2003. Moreover, the ECA have carried out audits of EU funds in co-operation with the SAIs of the acceding countries. Before and after these audits seminars were organised with support of TAIEX (the European Commission's Technical Assistance Information Exchange Office) to discuss the audit planning and the audit results.

During the discussion, Mr Shelyuto, representative of the SAI of the Russian Federation and Presidency of EUROSAI, indicated that, since 1995, the SAI of the Russian Federation has not received any information about audits of TACIS funds performed by the ECA in Russia, if there were any. He expressed the readiness of the SAI of the Russian Federation to set up a joint audit of these funds with the ECA.

6. Date and place of the next meeting:

The SAI of Denmark kindly proposed to host the next ETC meeting, on 24 and 25 November 2003 in Copenhagen.